GEORGE SAMPLE FULL INTERVIEW TRANSCRIPT
OPENING: WHAT THRIVING THROUGH MEANS
AJ: Welcome to this episode of Thriving Through, the podcast exclusively for self-employed consultants. Today, I'm honored to have George Sample as my guest. George, welcome to the show.
George: My pleasure to be here.
AJ: So, George, the title of this podcast is Thriving Through. What does thriving through mean to you?
George: Well, for me, it's making sure that we have grit and that we're persevering, because understanding this challenge of being an entrepreneur, being self-employed, it has its ups and downs. There are a lot of tough spots, but how can we make sure that we are going toward those goals we've set for ourselves? How can we ensure that we are finding the people that we need to attach to, to make sure that we are building communities for ourselves? But making sure that we keep on going towards that North Star, going towards that thing that we set out to do when we started this business, hopefully in order to have a positive impact on the lives of others.
AJ: Wonderful. Would you say that your business is thriving? Are you thriving through?
George: Oh, absolutely. It's been fantastic for my business to be able to impact leaders across the globe, helping them through coaching, helping them through workshops and keynotes, and also doing recruitment to help connect leaders with the next best opportunity. So it's been fantastic to be able to help people in all those different ways, especially managers and leaders, just finding that next level for themselves.
THE PATH FROM COMPUTER SCIENCE TO HR
AJ: So tell me about your path to self-employment.
George: My path is an interesting one, because even though I do this work, which is leadership development consulting, that's not my trade. My undergrad in college was computer science. So when I came out of college, I was a computer science guy. I started off writing computer code. I worked for a Fortune 500 manufacturing company, so my first 7 years was as a computer programmer.
A lot of that work ended up being HRIS work, so I got to know the folks in Human Resources really well. They got to know me. I was involved with our employee resource groups. I was actually one of the founders of the young professional group at that organization. So I got to build relationships across departments, across continents, because it was a global organization, and just make some really good connections in the organization.
And then I was offered the opportunity to move into a talent role in human resources. For me, there was this feeling of, hey, we can teach you some of the ins and outs of the role itself, but the relationships that you've built and the way you connect with people, those are some of the intangibles we want to have within this role. And I was thinking, sure, I'll do this for a couple years and then go back into IT. So that was, I don't know, two decades ago?
AJ: That was a long time ago.
George: So that was my foray into this talent management space. Just when I got into that work, I remember the first month I was in that role, we were having a global succession planning meeting. And the way they were talking about careers was a way I had no idea that organizations thought about careers and career development. It blew my mind, and I realized I'm not going back to IT, because it just resonated with me. It just absolutely resonated with me.
I went on to a few different other organizations as well: Federal Reserve System, utilities, libraries, different HR leadership types of roles, and was able to have so much impact for organizations. Now, in parallel with that story is community involvement.
THE POWER OF BOARD SERVICE
George: So I got involved with a bunch of different boards. It started off with John Carroll University. I went there for school, and I was invited to join the alumni board, our National Alumni Board. I just happened to work in the same place that the National Alumni Association president was, and he was asking, hey, you're really involved with John Carroll, would you be interested in being on the alumni board? I was thinking, that sounds great, I'm interested in that. So I joined the alumni board. That was the first board I joined, and I just learned what board service is about.
Currently, I serve on 5 different boards in the community, and there's a long, winding path of different boards I've had the opportunity to serve on over the course of my board service. One that I'm most proud of, I used to serve as president of the Cleveland Society of Human Resource Management. So, helping HR practitioners in the space make sure they can build community, connect with others, and also raise their skills and understand best practice and hear best practice from experts in the field.
BUILDING THE SIDE CONSULTING PRACTICE
George: With all this work I've been doing, especially through Cleveland SHRM, I actually started consulting on the side. Folks would come to me and say, hey, small organization, I'm an HR department of one, do you know someone who could help with this or that? And I'd say, hey, I can help you with that, because it was all stuff that was in my wheelhouse from the experiences I had with the big organizations I was in.
So I started consulting. A lot of it was helping organizations with recruitment, because even if they have an HR person, they don't have someone who has, as I have, run talent acquisition teams and really understands sourcing. So doing a lot of that. And then also with the organizations I was with, I did so much speaking on their behalf, talking about our best practices, going to local conferences, regional conferences, talking about our organizations, positioning us as an employer of choice.
So folks got to know me through that as well. It was people saying, hey, can you come talk to my company about this? Or come talk about that, or help us think about this effort that we're trying to launch? So, I actually, before I launched my own practice, was consulting on the side for 8-9 years, because I was just asked to do those things.
MAKING THE FULL-TIME LEAP
George: And it just got to the point where I was thinking, wait, I could have this be a full-time opportunity, or I could just continue to pick and choose and do what I want to do. I felt like I have the experience. I'm at a point where I have the skill set to be able to go out on my own. Let me give this a shot.
For me, it wasn't like I was fed up with corporate. I enjoyed corporate. I just felt like, maybe it's just time for me to go out and do my own thing. And all those years, doing this in the background, on the side, I just thought, alright, I have some momentum already. Let me just launch this thing. And I did, and it was absolutely fantastic.
I launched it in October of 2023, so it's been a little bit over a year. And my pipeline's full. I have enough work where, throughout this year, it'll take me through the year, in regards to the projects I have that I'm working on. So it's been absolutely fantastic.
Now, the things I do, I do three different types of services. So one, I do leadership coaching with leaders. Second one, I do workshops and keynotes. And then the third one is recruitment, so I do some exec search work as well. So I get to do those three things, all of which I absolutely love. And, when I say workshops, those are custom built for organizations. So I have a portfolio of about 15 different workshops I have, and then depending on what the organization needs, we'll bring some of those workshops and customize them for that organization.
And then keynotes are more industry event type things, where folks are trying to make sure that their group is fired up, jazzed up, ready to take on whatever challenge that they have. So workshops and keynotes kind of fit into that same bucket, and then that individual coaching, and then also that recruitment work.
When it comes to recruitment, I focus specifically on director level and above. And it's largely in HR, in DEI, in talent acquisition, and learning and development. And those are the spaces where I'm doing that recruitment work. I need to do that work, because that recruitment work, I'm accustomed to living a certain lifestyle. And that recruitment work pays the bills so I can do the workshops and the coaching, which I absolutely love.
BUSINESS DEVELOPMENT THROUGH COMMUNITY
AJ: So, I want to circle back to something that you said before, and you sort of mentioned it in passing, but you said that you're on 5 boards.
George: Yes.
AJ: And I think you underestimate how powerful that is. So can you unpack that just a little bit? You've been on boards for a long time. What has that done for your business?
George: So, being on boards, even before I went into business for myself, you're rubbing elbows with corporate leaders, you're rubbing elbows with nonprofit leaders, and just being engaged in the work of the board.
So the boards I'm currently on: I'm on John Carroll University Board of Directors. I'm the Vice President of the Board for the United Way of Greater Cleveland. I'm on the Board of the Cuyahoga County Public Library Foundation. I'm on the board of 1000 Ties, which is an organization that connects underserved youth with career opportunities. And then I'm on the Board of OATC, Ohio Association of Track and Cross Country, because I absolutely love track, and my daughters run track.
So being on those different boards, you're building relationships. For me, it's first and foremost about the mission of the organizations. And I try to have a portfolio of different boards that mean different things to me. So I have my alma mater, I have an organization that's trying to help out our most vulnerable neighbors, I have an organization that really hits on my passion for reading and literacy with the public library, and then an organization that's trying to connect underserved youth with opportunity, and then just my love for track and field.
All of those organizations have helped me build different types of relationships. The networking that happens on those boards is sometimes just incidental. But when you're in those board meetings, and folks get a sense of who you are, what your capabilities are, and understand, oh, he does this, this, and that for work, then you're top of mind. So, folks will come to me during breaks. They'll send me an email afterward. Saying, hey, I got this challenge, who do you know? Or is this something that you could help my organization with?
And just from, even with the Cleveland SHRM board, doing that for 6 years, doing that work, there were several consulting engagements that came as a result of that. Now I'm past president, so I still have my network there, and so still occasionally stuff comes in through those doors. But being on boards is one of the best ways to continually be networking, because you're doing those board meetings monthly, you're doing different committees that you're working with with those folks, you're going to events for the organization.
So you have continual, perpetual networking, just by being a board member. So I don't know when people talk about needing to network more, I'm thinking, get on a board! Just get on a board, because that's a way that you're going to be connected to so many different people, and you're doing good, too. You get to make an impact on the organization and the people that they serve. But you also get to build relationships that can absolutely help you in your own business or your own career goals.
THE ROLE OF SPEAKING ENGAGEMENTS
AJ: Talk a little bit about the speaking that you do, because that's also, I mean, you've got these three different channels, I guess, or three different strategies. You've got the boards, you've got the speaking, and then you've also got your own, you have a very healthy pipeline. So, talk about the speaking, because that's something that most people don't think about.
George: Yeah, so speaking, I try to do a couple of speaking engagements a month, whether that's, I'm speaking at an organization, I'm speaking at a conference, or speaking at a, it could be a small meet-up, or it could be a larger thing.
For me, with the speaking, I have a portfolio of different topics I talk about. I'm always trying to work on my craft when it comes to speaking. Folks tell me I'm good at it, I believe them, but I want to be even better. So I'm always, constantly trying to up my game when it comes to speaking. I've had some speech coaching. I'm always trying to consume content, when it comes to better storytelling, better engagement. I want to continually get better, because if I'm going to go out and speak and represent my firm, I want to be phenomenal when I do that.
So, and it's one of the ways that you can show your expertise, show your passion. And it's one of those things where you can have an hour of someone's time. And if you're phenomenal in that hour, they're going to remember you. They're going to be able to tell someone else about you. It's one of those instances where, if you do it well, you can make a phenomenal impact.
And folks will come to you afterward for questions. They'll seek you out on LinkedIn. They'll send you messages. For me, I'm an open networker on LinkedIn. I'll never turn down a LinkedIn connection. Never have, never will. So, I welcome folks to connect with me on LinkedIn, because I know for me, when I'm doing those speaking engagements and different things, folks are going to connect with me. And I want to make sure that I can engage with them and help them when I can.
CONTINUOUS LEARNING AS COMPETITIVE ADVANTAGE
AJ: One of the things that I took away from our pre-interview call was that you are constantly learning, and you're constantly listening to audiobooks and podcasts.
George: Yeah.
AJ: And you had a whole list that you shared with me, and I'm going to ask you about that in a minute. But why is this important?
George: So, when I think about this, especially in the work that I do, there are so many other leadership consultants, there are so many other coaches that are out there. The thing that I can do to make sure that I'm staying ahead, or at least on par, if not ahead, is making sure that I'm constantly sharpening my saw.
So there's a quote that I love. If you give me 6 hours to chop down a tree, I'm going to spend the first 4 hours sharpening my ax. And that's kind of the space that I am. So I understand that the work that I do requires me to be able to drop knowledge, to be able to give resources, to be able to make connections for folks, to be able to share research, to share different content that they can consume.
And the only way that I can do that is if I'm staying ahead, if I'm constantly consuming things. So, audiobooks are my preferred modality, because I can listen while I'm driving, I can listen while I'm working out, I can listen while I'm doing the dishes. So it's a way that I can use time efficiently to be able to consume.
And yes, sometimes I'll listen to fiction just because I need a brain break, and just need something easy. But for the most part, it's business-related audiobooks that I'm consuming, so that I can make sure that I can constantly have more tools in my toolkit to be able to help the people that I'm working with.
RESOURCES FOR CONSULTANTS
AJ: So what are some of your favorite resources? Give me your top list.
George: So, Flawless Consultant by Peter Block, that has been a fantastic read. The Referable Speaker by Michael Port, I think he did that one, is fantastic in regards to getting stage-side leads and how good you have to be for this.
Deep Work by Cal Newport is a reminder that time blocking and making sure that I can have time to really get into the work, that's why I try to block off time to do reading and writing all the time. Because you have to be thoughtful about, how do I get to a space where I can be always upping the craft that I have of this work that I do.
Donald Miller just has a bunch of fantastic books when it comes to this business thing. One of them is called The Coaching Practice, I don't know, whatever. You search Donald Miller, he has, and he's funny. He delivers it in a great way. I'm audio, I'm Audible books, audiobook kind of person. So, he has 5 or 6 different books that are fantastic for the coach or consultant.
Brian Tracy's another one in regards to goals. He has a book that I just downloaded earlier today called Million Dollar Habits. I haven't hopped into it, but his other book, Goals, is one of the ones that I tapped into. This is 15 years ago, that was helpful for me earlier on. So, Brian Tracy, he's a prolific author, I don't know, 50 different books that he has that have been helpful, but Goals is one of the books that's been exceptionally helpful to me.
As a coach, Michael Bungay Stanier, he has a couple different books, specifically in regards to coaching, that are easy to digest for you, and that have been helpful.
And then I always talk, when I talk about communication, I always talk about different forms of communication, so you have influence, you have negotiation. From a negotiation standpoint, I love Stuart Diamond's work, Getting More. That's my favorite negotiation text, so I do negotiation workshops. You have the stuff out of Harvard, you have Chris Voss with Never Split the Difference, which is an easy read. My favorite book is by Stuart Diamond, Getting More when it comes to negotiation, which is a different kind of communication.
But then you talk about influence, so I do a keynote that talks about influence. My favorite author when it comes to influence is Robert Cialdini, so he has both Influence and Persuasion. Both of those are fantastic. If you would like the closest thing to Jedi mind tricks, I highly recommend both the books by Robert Cialdini, both Influence and Persuasion, which are fantastic books.
Then on influence, you have Vital Smarts with Influencer, or Critical Influence, is how they retitled the book now, which is another great text when it comes to influence.
I can go on and on about this. I'm absolutely a business audiobook nerd. I have all the ones you want that are there. Whenever I need some new stuff, Shane Parrish has the Knowledge Podcast. Whenever I need to hear some new stuff, he has great content. Tim Ferriss has a great podcast. He'll often have folks, when he has that person, I'll go and find the audiobook for the person, because when a person does a book, they have to go on tour, so sometimes I'll hear them both on Tim Ferriss, and I'll hear them on the Knowledge Podcast with Shane Parrish, and if I hear them on both, I know it's an automatic read, or automatic listen, for me.
So it's been great to be able to dive into all the different sources of knowledge, and to be able to continually build my skill set and my knowledge base to be able to drop these in during coaching sessions or workshops or whatever I'm working on to make sure that when I'm interacting with folks, I'm equipping them with as many skills and tools as they can use, and also different sources of knowledge as well.
I have my favorite professor from college, Scott Allen. He has a podcast called Phronesis. It's specifically in regards to leadership. If you have not checked out Phronesis, I highly, highly, highly recommend that. He's a phenomenal leadership expert. He's a consultant now. He's crushing it. He's been in business for a little bit less than I have, I think, but he's been absolutely crushing it. Phronesis, he has 300 episodes with world-class names that he has. He brings people from all different places all across the globe talking about this topic of leadership. Apparently, you can talk about leadership for 300 episodes. But just a phenomenal podcast, Phronesis by Scott Allen.
I will stop saying words, because I've been saying a whole bunch of words in regards to this. I could talk about the different sources I've used for a long time, so I appreciate the question.
CONNECTING WITH GEORGE
AJ: Well, and this is the last question, and the most important question. If people want to find out more about you and what you do, where do they go?
George: Yeah, Blue Streak Consultants. So, Blue Streak Consultants. Blue Streak, so I'm a John Carroll grad twice, undergrad was a party, grad school was a beating, but I always tell folks, John Carroll University is my favorite place on Earth. So the mascot is Blue Streaks, so my business is called Blue Streak Consultants.
You can also find me on LinkedIn. If you see one of our posts, repost or comment. I'm always engaging on LinkedIn. I said earlier in the interview, I'm always on, so if you comment at 6 AM on Saturday morning, I'm going to reply at 6:05.
AJ: Great. And the links to your LinkedIn profile will be in the show notes for those of you listening. Well, George, it has been wonderful to speak with you today, and you have so much energy, and you're so articulate, it's really wonderful to have you on the show. And for those of you listening or watching, keep thriving through.